Reasons why I have reservations about Christianity
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So in other words you believe that the bread has turned into the flesh of Christ and the wine turned into the blood of Christ?Originally posted by Ito_^:its not a link.. its really typed out. anyways, different subject altogether. i tot i saw the word communion when i skimmed through but its not about the Holy Communion.
And yes, the bread is the body of Jesus and the wine(over sweetened ribena actually) is the blood, etc.
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yes and yesOriginally posted by SingaporeMacross:So in other words you believe that the bread has turned into the flesh of Christ and the wine turned into the blood of Christ?
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Originally posted by Ito_^:yes and yes
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aiyoh .. I think you may not be clear .. go and ask your cell group leader (if they knowOriginally posted by Ito_^:yes and yes
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Ask them whether your church believes in TRANSUBSTANTIATION? -
Well, I cannot stomach those evangelists who preach not by showing the good works of Christ but attempt to convert from the angle that all other religions are demonizing.This places me in conflict with what I have been taught when I was in Bible class, that God created man equal and of free will.Originally posted by laurence82:Why dont you try on me when i am drunk? keke
Anyway, no problem with Christianity within my family, as in the larger extensions
I am happy to say my auntie's family is Catholic, and practise non of the nonsense the evangelists do
My stance is that of a Methodist who believes that faith comes before works and salvation is not guaranteed unless you have made a serious attempt at leading a good life.
God is inside us and I have a personal relationship with him.I will not condemn the religions of others, rather I also believe that each soul has to find his or her own way to God, in his or her own time. -
I think, that as this is Christian forum, there is no reason to discuss about other faiths if one have insufficient knowledge of them. Its absolutely slanderous, and bring out great prejudice against other faiths.
Check out the other thread where Buddhism, Hinduism and Islam was discussed at length. Not only some of the posts are total hogwash, it bring about the perception that other faiths are totally evil.
Seriously, will it widen the gulf among different faiths? I dare say yes. Its these fanatics who solely preach faith in god, but lack moral actions to bring about better life for others that irks me. -
wat the heck? A clone?Originally posted by laurence82:I think, that as this is Christian forum, there is no reason to discuss about other faiths if one have insufficient knowledge of them. Its absolutely slanderous, and bring out great prejudice against other faiths.
Check out the other thread where Buddhism, Hinduism and Islam was discussed at length. Not only some of the posts are total hogwash, it bring about the perception that other faiths are totally evil.
Seriously, will it widen the gulf among different faiths? I dare say yes. Its these fanatics who solely preach faith in god, but lack moral actions to bring about better life for others that irks me.
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hey how come my account change? and where is my P membership?
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then your stance is that of salvation by works which was never the case in the bible. We are saved by faith and our works are because we are saved not to get saved.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Well, I cannot stomach those evangelists who preach not by showing the good works of Christ but attempt to convert from the angle that all other religions are demonizing.This places me in conflict with what I have been taught when I was in Bible class, that God created man equal and of free will.
My stance is that of a Methodist who believes that faith comes before works and salvation is not guaranteed unless you have made a serious attempt at leading a good life.
God is inside us and I have a personal relationship with him.I will not condemn the religions of others, rather I also believe that each soul has to find his or her own way to God, in his or her own time. -
Woah! Similiar thoughts!Originally posted by LazerLordz:Well, I cannot stomach those evangelists who preach not by showing the good works of Christ but attempt to convert from the angle that all other religions are demonizing.This places me in conflict with what I have been taught when I was in Bible class, that God created man equal and of free will.
My stance is that of a Methodist who believes that faith comes before works and salvation is not guaranteed unless you have made a serious attempt at leading a good life.
God is inside us and I have a personal relationship with him.I will not condemn the religions of others, rather I also believe that each soul has to find his or her own way to God, in his or her own time.
I should visit Methodist church liao.
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let me clarify that, it is not once saved always saved... I agree with that part, but the only reason why one would lose your salvation is because of your renounciation of your faith... our salvation is free, it is not through works... but works come as a result of our salvationOriginally posted by LazerLordz:Well, I cannot stomach those evangelists who preach not by showing the good works of Christ but attempt to convert from the angle that all other religions are demonizing.This places me in conflict with what I have been taught when I was in Bible class, that God created man equal and of free will.
My stance is that of a Methodist who believes that faith comes before works and salvation is not guaranteed unless you have made a serious attempt at leading a good life.
God is inside us and I have a personal relationship with him.I will not condemn the religions of others, rather I also believe that each soul has to find his or her own way to God, in his or her own time.
our works are for the crowns which we will put at the feet of Jesus... sorry if I sounded a bit hard...
taking the stance that you have, you are never really sure of your salvation are you? but Jesus wants us to be secure in our faith and our salvation and that the only thing that would separate us would be if we left Him.
to say that Christians hate other religions is not true, we don't agree with their creeds and the way they do things, but we don't hate any person on this earth... i think people should be very careful to use the word hate as it conjurs strong negative connotations... and we certainly do not hate...
we have our own view points that these other "gods" from other religions are demonic but that is part of what we believe in and if we give an opinion on it... I think that people from other religions should take it as that our view... we certainly don't go around saying we hate other religions just because they have a contrary belief... so you non-believers out there, just chill. -
for the jaded, here is a new option. satanism. for those who condemn it know not what it truely is about. man is always afraid of the unknown. once u know the unknown, there is nothing to fear.
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Well, I did not water down the value of works, merely saying that they should not be presented as the end all and be all.Works must be done in concert with unshakeable faith.Originally posted by breytonhartge:let me clarify that, it is not once saved always saved... I agree with that part, but the only reason why one would lose your salvation is because of your renounciation of your faith... our salvation is free, it is not through works... but works come as a result of our salvation
our works are for the crowns which we will put at the feet of Jesus... sorry if I sounded a bit hard...
taking the stance that you have, you are never really sure of your salvation are you? but Jesus wants us to be secure in our faith and our salvation and that the only thing that would separate us would be if we left Him.
to say that Christians hate other religions is not true, we don't agree with their creeds and the way they do things, but we don't hate any person on this earth... i think people should be very careful to use the word hate as it conjurs strong negative connotations... and we certainly do not hate...
we have our own view points that these other "gods" from other religions are demonic but that is part of what we believe in and if we give an opinion on it... I think that people from other religions should take it as that our view... we certainly don't go around saying we hate other religions just because they have a contrary belief... so you non-believers out there, just chill.
I'm a Christian who does not follow the conventional path of churchgoing, does that make me any lesser in the eyes of God?Only He can judge, not humans. -
its not about the works, its about the faith... and yes you are right it is ultimately God who judges us.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Well, I did not water down the value of works, merely saying that they should not be presented as the end all and be all.Works must be done in concert with unshakeable faith.
I'm a Christian who does not follow the conventional path of churchgoing, does that make me any lesser in the eyes of God?Only He can judge, not humans. -
One bloody big circle.Originally posted by breytonhartge:its not about the works, its about the faith... and yes you are right it is ultimately God who judges us.
M© stoops down and draw. -
I absolutely agree with your first para. I am a very unconventional christian too and by that I mean I challenge the traditions in the church and insist on the relevance of the church to the modern world without compromising on God's standards.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Well, I did not water down the value of works, merely saying that they should not be presented as the end all and be all.Works must be done in concert with unshakeable faith.
I'm a Christian who does not follow the conventional path of churchgoing, does that make me any lesser in the eyes of God?Only He can judge, not humans.
However on your 2nd para on not going to church, of cos I am not saying that going to a "CHURCH BUILDING" is necessary. But when CHURCH is mentioned in the BIBLE, it means "an assembly and grouping of people who have given their hearts to Christ."
Therefore, when you say you do not go to church, do u mean u stop going to a CHURCH BUILDING or do you mean you are forsaking the assembling of together as COMMANDED in HEBREWS 10:25 "Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching."? -
Well,I have a small group of friends and we sometimes discuss Christianity.And some of us are Catholic, some Baptist and some non-denominational.Originally posted by gasband:I absolutely agree with your first para. I am a very unconventional christian too and by that I mean I challenge the traditions in the church and insist on the relevance of the church to the modern world without compromising on God's standards.
However on your 2nd para on not going to church, of cos I am not saying that going to a "CHURCH BUILDING" is necessary. But when CHURCH is mentioned in the BIBLE, it means "an assembly and grouping of people who have given their hearts to Christ."
Therefore, when you say you do not go to church, do u mean u stop going to a CHURCH BUILDING or do you mean you are forsaking the assembling of together as COMMANDED in HEBREWS 10:25 "Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching."? -
Firstly, I must state that when I asked, there is no way i meant it any other way than being concerned. While I agree that going to a church building is ABSOLUTELY NOT necessary for a christian, it should be seen that a church building is nothing more than a structure to house the real CHURCH - which is US. And its purpose is to let us gather there namely to - Worship, Pray to, Exalt our God and also to encourage and fellowship with our fellow bros and sisters -Originally posted by LazerLordz:Well,I have a small group of friends and we sometimes discuss Christianity.And some of us are Catholic, some Baptist and some non-denominational.
Seriously, if the group you gather in does not gather to do what a 'CHURCH' was meant to do and that is to Worship, Pray to, Exalt our God and also to encourage and fellowship with our fellow bros and sisters , you are not doing what God commanded us to do.
OF COURSE, i am not saying that you must run to a church right now. What I mean is that in your own group right now, maybe you can start incorporating these elements. Remember, JESUS, like you, was also unconventional. It really doesnt matter you do not go to a church but it does matter you do what God wants you to do, regardless where, how and when. -
Then I invite you to read the following link:Originally posted by Ito_^:yes and yes
http://www.therealpresence.org/eucharst/a.html
Blessed is He who has not seen, and yet believes. -
That is the problem.
If just simply worshipping god and not doing any works or charity, will lead u to heaven, then this is the path i will not take.
Why will i be happy in heaven, if i know there is still sufferrng in the human world, knowing i have that little ability and power to alleviate them? You cant help them all, but you can help one.
The problems of just worshipping alone has already manifested right here in sgforums.
You get all kinds of people who think they are superior simply because they have a different faith, You have people who dont find the need to do charity because worshipping god alone is good enuff. Better yet unconventional Christian like gasband already find it neccessary to do more than worship solely.
I have already find it disgusting when these fanatics simply pooh pooh the many great acts of the late Pope and Mother Teresa, when they are the ones who want to lift up human suffering, and broker peace among different groups. -
wad type of satanism you toking about..Originally posted by HENG@:for the jaded, here is a new option. satanism. for those who condemn it know not what it truely is about. man is always afraid of the unknown. once u know the unknown, there is nothing to fear. -
We're back to the Faith vs. Faith+Works argument.Originally posted by M©+square:One bloody big circle.
M© stoops down and draw. -
Frankly, i wonder what's there to argue.Originally posted by Ito_^:We're back to the Faith vs. Faith+Works argument. -
ya lor. i understand both sides. one is faith alone, den do good works as evidence, other is first faith, den do good works to show. its not even battle of heaven and hell, and its not even funny.Originally posted by M©+square:Frankly, i wonder what's there to argue.
knn. go heaven can liao, complain so much for wad. scarly premature go heaven den u noe. -
I understand what you are getting at...Originally posted by laurence82:That is the problem.
If just simply worshipping god and not doing any works or charity, will lead u to heaven, then this is the path i will not take.
Why will i be happy in heaven, if i know there is still sufferrng in the human world, knowing i have that little ability and power to alleviate them? You cant help them all, but you can help one.
St Vincent De Paul says, "Whoever serves the poor, serves God."
In case you wanted to know, he is the patron Saint of charitable societies.